From Episcopal Life:
Episcopal News Service] On the eve of the November 2-3 annual convention of the Episcopal Diocese of Pittsburgh, Bishop Robert Duncan rejected Presiding Bishop Katharine Jefferts Schori's request that he lead the diocese away from efforts to disaffiliate from the Episcopal Church.
The three-sentence letter, dated November 1, said in full: "Here I stand. I can do no other. I will neither compromise the Faith once delivered to the saints, nor will I abandon the sheep who elected me to protect them."
Bishop Duncan's response is short, but not so sweet, referencing Martin Luther's "Diet of Worms" speech. Well, I suppose they'll be heading out of the Episcopal Church to greener pastures. The question is when?
Bishop Duncan says that if the two constitutional amendments pass, this will change nothing for a year, until the amendments are ratified at the next diocesan convention. According to the bishop, the move is a "warning", an "intention", a "possibility" until 2008. But could the action of the first vote be seen as a violation of the Constitution and Canons of the Episcopal Church? I will leave the answer to that question to those who know more than I.
UPDATE: Fr. Jake sheds more light on the question:
He [Duncan] is correct; this changes nothing. But, it does place the Diocese of Pittsburgh in a rather strange transitional state in which they are still part of the Episcopal Church, but not fully. And since their connection to the Anglican Communion is through the Episcopal Church, they are also caught in an inbetween place in regards to their status within the Communion. They have chosen what might best be decribed as "Anglican Limbo," at least until next year.
Read the whole of Fr. Jakes post.
UPDATE 2: Clumber at Barkings Of An Old Dog has a couple of pictures that are worth at least two thousand words, here and here. Check them out.
I say throw the bum out.
ReplyDeleteDennis, I'd say the same, but unfortunately you and I don't get to have a say - except for here, where is doesn't really count.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, this morning something occurred to me:
ReplyDeleteWe have already pulled off one gathering.
Let's throw this thing wide open.
We should try to put together a "Progressive Episcopal Bloggers" convention.
And perhaps we should reach out to the Episcopal Majorty crowd and the Integrity crowd and the Via Media blogs and even to the Episcopalians over at Street Prophets.
I know that the east coast was a little out of the way for some people but maybe with enough advanced notice... I sort of would like to suggest the east coast again, just because if we are going to do this again I'd like bishops there this time. You think a certain primate might make her way over to a progressive Episcopal blogger gathering if we invite her real nice and pretty like?
March? Weekend of 21 March 08?
What a conceited, self-satisfied pratt! The response of a man whose whole life is lived admiring his own reflection.
ReplyDeleteDennis, you really did get your batteries recharged, didn't you?
ReplyDeleteGetting Progressive Episcopal bloggers together sounds like a great idea. Do you mean a conference-type meeting with speakers and such? That's a big undertaking. We'd need help with something like that.
...I'd like bishops there this time.
We were not too far from a certain bishop's office, but she didn't know we were there, or I'm sure she'd have stopped by.
Lapin, for a minute there, I forgot the subject of the post, and I thought you were talking about Dennis and that the the two of you would be duking it out on my blog.
do you know that it's possible that Luther never said "Here I Stand?" Those words are not in the earliest editions recounting his words at the Diet.
ReplyDeletewhat a shock!
He did say the thing about it not being safe to go against conscience.
I don't know all the ins and outs of you guys' politics.
We have our own, too.
For the record, I was talking about Robert Duncan.
ReplyDeleteI don't know all the ins and outs of you guys' politics.
ReplyDeleteDiane, I don't know all the ins and outs of the politics myself.
And it's odd about some of the things we are convinced that people said, and they never did. I found it strange that Duncan quoted Luther. Maybe he wants to join up with y'all. ;o)
Lapin, I did realize after a bit that you were speaking of Duncan.
Oh, the anti-gay bigots in the Presbyterian church love Luther's so-called words as well. I've heard them used in almost the exact same situation at least 3 times. Always about needing to take churches away from the denomination.
ReplyDeleteThe irony of taking a progressive stand and making it regressive. ugh.
LJ, y'all can have him, too, if you want him. You Lutherans and Presbyterians can begin right now to lure him away.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I think he wants to run his own church - a whole new thing.
A conceited, self-satisfied pratt with an apparent $30mil in his pocket... which brings up an interesting aspect of how to freeze those assets so he doesn't misuse them on his way out the door.
ReplyDeleteWow Bob wow (for all the Twin Peaks fans out there!)
Does this mean that Bishop Duncan will now eat worms?
ReplyDeleteI was surprised. I expected we'd hear how he didn't really mean what he said, and she (being an apostate woman and a meany, to boot) was just looking for a way to boot him, but, he seems to have stuck to his guns.
ReplyDeleteSo, we should - loudly - hold our leadership to the responsibility of booting him.
Which is not to say that the letter didn't sound like teenaged angst, ratcheted up to the hysterical "NONE OF YOU CARE ABOUT ME! NONE OF YOU!!" with a dramatic flounce out the door.
Can we all say "self-imporant"? Very good, children. Now let's help little Bobby practice saying, "I am a self-important fool who thinks he is leading a new Reformation, purging a corrupt church, and saving souls left and right." No, Bobby, you can't say the rest of the sentence until you first say "I am a self-important fool."
ReplyDeleteI'm waiting for Bobby to hie himself to a castle somewhere and claim that ++Katharine's militia were trying to kill him. Dick Scaife doesn't live in a castle and I don't know how much protection he would provide if Duncan were no longer useful in breaking up TEC.
ReplyDeleteWow, Clumber, wow, the old dogs back home, I see.
ReplyDeletePaul(a.), the Diet of Worms always cracked us up as kids.
Mark, Duncan says he doesn't really think he's done anything final yet, but I hope that his exodus won't be allowed to play out over a year.
Piskie, I have no doubt that he will work accusations of persecution into his drama.
I saw the great man in person at the ecumenical service in New Orleans. He's quite distinctive looking.
Four "I's" in three sentences. Not bad going.
ReplyDeleteBoy George was in town for a fundraiser yesterday, Mimi, snarling up rush-hour traffic. The University sent out an email, warning those living on the East side of the city or planning to use the E-W interstates (the airport is on the West side of town) that life was going to be very difficult - long delays - at rush-hour. The fundraiser was for the re-election campaign of Strom's successor, Lindsay Graham, widely tipped on the internet as the target of an impending "outing" campaign.
Lapin, lucky, lucky you to have the boy king in town to snarl up rush hour traffic. Lindsey Graham has been a good little boy and given W support in the crunch in various dirty deeds.
ReplyDeleteThe gay story has been around for a while. What makes the story interesting are the anti-gay votes Graham has cast.
The other problem with Graham is that he's by far the most "liberal" member of the SC Republican rat-pack. If he goes,as he most surely will if any hint of scandal hits the major media, there's going to be a scary bunch of knuckle-grazers brawling to fill his "light loafers" - as the then-chairman of the State Democratic Party very incorrectly described Graham's shoes five years back. Thomas Ravenel, the recently-elected State Treasurer and Neanderthal, was supposedly positioning himself to challenge Graham from the Far-Right when he came to grief this summer on a Federal possession and distribution of cocaine indictment, to which he has pleaded guilty.
ReplyDeleteBernard Shaw said that "anarchism is a game at which the police can always beat you". The precept seems to hold true for many upholders of Law and Order!
DENNIS:
ReplyDeleteYour proposed date for the "convocation" is Easter weekend... with the 21st being Good Friday. Perhaps not the best choice!
But NYC II sounds great, and I hope to know about it this time around.
Lapin, I see that Graham may be the best that SC can offer. It's often like that in the South, having to choose the lesser of evils.
ReplyDeleteDavid, we surely did not mean to leave anyone out. I hope that if we do meet again, you will join us.
I have signed up for a Smithsonian Metropolitan Opera trip in March, from 3-7, so the March 8 date would work great for me, since I'll already be there. I don't know that I would be able to make two trips in March or very soon thereafter.
We may be going to Disney World in February, during the Mardi Gras holidays.
Mimi: Unless I missed something, Dennis is proposing the 21st of March... not the 8th.
ReplyDeleteJust so you're aware when setting the date for this: early March can be not the most enjoyable time in NYC. It's often still wintry then... with freezing rain, wind, etc. Whereas, nothing is more glorious as when spring arrives a month later. The Cloisters on the first spring day: yesss!
Well, I just thought post-Easter would be easier on people's schedules, but I hear what you're saying about two trips though. And I confess that my proposal of March 31 was not completely without self-interest. Nam and I will be taking our first-ever cruise in March and returning to San Juan on March 29th. We'll not be returning to CA until a week later, and we had planned on flying up to DC for that week before returning home. I would have gladly changed the agenda to NYC instead. And, in fact, would probably fly out to NYC additionally at any other time when it's convenient for the rest. But I still don't think Good Friday is going to work for most people.
What about June or February?
ReplyDeletePerhaps we go ahead with the New Orleans idea but put it on the weekend after Easter?
Or what about June?
Would Chicago work for anyone in July?
David, I believe that Dennis suggested the Mar. 8, too. The good thing about New York in Feb. is that the hotels are cheap. I know. We've done it. We took the ferry to Ellis Island in 18 degree weather, not fun, exactly, but not that bad.
ReplyDeleteBut then, I have the Disney World trip in early Feb. 2-6.
If the group came to New Orleans, the only bishop you'd see is Charles Jenkins and perhaps retired Bishop Brown.
If we could get the message to Bp. Jenkins on the numbers of gays in our group, it might be an eye-opener and a witness, especially if we spent a day working on a recovery project.
If all you gay guys dressed gay and minced enough, he might get the message.
June is good.
I like June too. June in NYC can very very lovely. As I think of nearly any place, gathering *before* MID-June avoids the hoards of kids out of school on vacation.
ReplyDeleteMimi, back to topic!!!!
ReplyDelete"I saw the great man in person at the ecumenical service in New Orleans. He's quite distinctive looking."
You must be talking about the eyebrows?
And I realize that the topic may be exhausted already. How can we talk about someone who has just vowed to stand there? How much more _boring_ can it get?
ReplyDeleteSusan, it's true. The eyebrows kind of reach out and grab you.
ReplyDeleteHow can we talk about someone who has just vowed to stand there?
But is he STANDING FIRM? That is the question.
To quote the wonderful Episcopalifem, "LMAO!"
ReplyDeleteWhat about June in Boston?
ReplyDeleteI am thinking somewhere on the east coast because it would be nice to get some notice by the church structures. Right now the only voice they are hearing from the web tilts far to the right.
Also there seems to be a very large number of blogging Episcopalians on the east coast (it matches the demographics of the larger Episcopal Church in that).
I would be coming from Seattle, which is so far removed from the rest of the country it is equally out of the way to just about everywhere. So I don't have a dog in this race.
Perhaps some of the good progressive bishops on the east coast would troop up to Boston.
Or do we need to look at NYC or Washington DC?
What about Philadelphia? TEC was organized there, lots of beautiful and historic buildings, close to NYC and Washington DC
Distance factor same with me, so any of those four (NYC, DC, Boston, Philly) sounds fine. Still think NYC is the best, but a convincing case could easily be made for any of them.
ReplyDeleteBy way of nothing... Lambeth is from July 10 (or 16 depending) thru Aug. 3rd.
Thanks for the Clumber links. The related posting at OCICBW now makes sense.
ReplyDeleteDennis, you have a great idea. Can anyone come, or do we need invites like Lambeth?
ReplyDeleteJune would be great for us academics, too. I am green with envy that I missed the MPFest in NY.
At first I thought paul(a) was referencing the old song:
"Nobody loves me,
Everybody hates me,
I think I'll go eat worms!"
Diet of worms, indeed!
"Bob Pittsburgh". How many other US diocesans use this C of E "territorial" form of signing? "Charles New Orleans"? Or is this one more manifestation of the man's overwhelming self-regard?
ReplyDeleteAgha, the gathering is not exclusive or by invitation. It is open.
ReplyDeleteLapin, that "Bob Pittsburgh" is plumb weird. Our bishop would be "Charles Louisiana" - ridiculous, no? Perhaps, Bob's choice of signature has more to do with aping the British aristocracy, i. e., Charles, Prince of Wales. But shouldn't it be Bob, Bishop of Pittsburgh?
The English bishops,or at least some of them, sit as spiritual "Lords" in the Upper House, which may have something to do with this. I've posted a question about it on Thinking Anglicans which may coax out an informative & fun reply or two. Incumbents of "older" (pre-reformation) bishoprics usually sign with an abbreviated form of the Latin name of their diocese, "Cantuar", "Ebor" (York), "Dunelm" (Durham). Too grand for words! What's the Latin for Pittsburgh? Fast as the man appears to be deteriorating, surely it can't be long in coming.
ReplyDeleteLike Clumber's name for him - "Bob Pitts"!
Lapin, every time I see or hear "Cantuar", I cringe. I'm such a low-brow.
ReplyDelete