I don't give a good G*d damn if this Page person was confusing Sikhs with Muslims; I don't care if he confuses Christians with Spittle-flecked Snake Handlers. I'm sick and tired of armed nutcases walking into places were people are assembled and shooting up the place. I'm sorry, but someone's second amendment right does not trump everyone else's first amendment right to assemble. I think that the right to assemble safely is more important than disturbed person's desire to wear camouflage and carry arms. And I'm not interested in any lecture on how assault weapons don't exist or that they're great for hunting wild boar.
'Nuff said. And from the comments:
And, I find it troubling that "sorry, he thought they were Muslims" is somehow supposed to be meaningful in this storyline.
....
How about people's right simply to live?
Padre knows when/how to say NO! This takes real courage...no more sick bullsh*t from demented basta*dos dressed up in Uncle Sam outfits or floor to ceiling tattoos.
ReplyDeleteLen, I've had enough, too, and Padre's words resonated. I actually went a little crazy for a couple of days on hearing of another group of people killed so soon after the Colorado incident.
ReplyDeletePadre Mickey does it again!
ReplyDeleteThe viciousness and sometimes just plain old insanity of it all KEEPS pointing back to very troubled human beings...it ain´t the victims (people of color, different religions or LGBT people and heterosexual women in general) but the frustrated outcast sociopaths/psychopaths are NOW backing up on THEMSELVES like bad plumbing and ill maintained toilets...there running out of places to hide from themselves and others and there is NO solution for us than to pray for the lifting of sickness (through willingness for treatment) for those abused and to keep the Hell away from them both close up and from afar. Disengaging with sociopaths is a MUST! Recognizing these very ¨troubled¨ persons are dangerous, mentally ill (and not just freedom and purity seeking spirits) and keeping boundries of awareness around us will keep vile actions away as best we can. These dangerous men and women are backing themselves into corners and have no place to go...beware as many of them are trapped in ignorance by greedy politicos. My opinion only.
ReplyDeleteThe hateful groups, the hateful talk, the hateful posters, all stir up strong feelings, and people with mental illness and violent proclivities are especially vulnerable to provocation. The powerful guns are so readily available, so the result of the combination is bound, in some cases, to lead to tragedy.
ReplyDeleteWe need sensible gun control laws and much better access to mental health services in this country. And the rhetoric needs to be toned down by those who seek public office and those who run their campaigns. Words and images count.
Let me throw out a curve ball here: some years ago my late husband and I rented the first of the Batman movies, from 1990-something. I remembered the 60's comics and TV show fondly. However, though I wasn't expecting it to be a comedy, I was profoundly distressed by that movie: the ugliest, most sadistic, most amoral film I have ever seen in my life. There was no sense of values there; or rather, the only values it seemed to portray were those of a sociopath. And I'm talking about the good people in the movie!
ReplyDeleteI won't take up space in your blog to run down a long list of other examples, but this kind of thing - not to mention blood, guts, gore, murder, psychopathic hatred, and other evils, has been standard fare both in the movies and on TV in your living rooms for more than 30 years now. And nobody, not a soul in this oh-so-enlightened day and age, thinks anything about it, nor hesitates to let the youngest children grow up watching this garbage day in and day out.
Since you've opened free speech can, Mimi, could we also talk about the cumulutative effect of all these thousands of hours of horror and amorality on impressionable minds, young and old?
Of course, I realize - nobody at all wants to go there. It's much, much easier to blame a crazy man with a weapon than to ask who and what made him so crazy in the first place.
Just sayin'.
Russ, children grow up with violent images, such as the Road Runner cartoons, from an early age. We read them fairy tales, which are filled with violence. And now the video games. Where do you start, and where do you stop?
ReplyDeleteI avoid violent movies no matter how great the reviews, because I simply can't stand the images. I have no true answers, but I do believe the accumulation of violent imagery probably has an effect. Having said that, I don't have answers as to how we move forward.
Well, if as you seemed to suggest in your earlier comments, free speech needs to be restricted - or that's where I thought your train of thought was headed, anyway - how logical is it, then, to say that somebody's "hate speech" will provoke someone else to mass murder - but that 10,000 hours a year of the most godawful, gruesome, grisly, amoral entertainment in a kid's home, often right in his bedroom, has, oh, no effect whatsoever - it's only TV, ha ha ha.
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BTW, I remember being a kid very clearly, unlike some folks who say they just can't remember anything about their childhood - and as to the fairy tales and the Road Runner, etc. - the difference is that you knew - I knew - it was all for fun - played for laughs, or for a twist of plot.
Which to my mind is a very different thing from today's TV shows and movies, which are hyperrealistic and purport to show theoretically fully-formed adults behaving like murderous maniacs or in truly gruesome, morbid ways. Over and over and over and over and over again.
But as I said, nobody at all wants to examine this side of the coin, so I'll stop right here.
As to free speech, I had in mind self-restraint rather than laws, although I may not have made that clear.
DeleteI knew the cartoons were just play, but some of the fairy tales frightened me. The great majority of kids seem to grow up without turning violent as a result of watching violence in movies and TV shows and playing violent video games. I agree we should examine the effects of the violent images, and some experts are doing so, but I have no answers at the present time as to what we should do.
Speaking of fairy tales, if I had my wish all the violent images would go away, but I don't suggest that as a realistic solution.
Of course, Grandma, these mass killings are appalling but seen from Europe (especially England) it seems to me so strange that the US still holds gun freedoms so high. Please believe me I’m not being cynical when I say that I fear that your death toll is not yet high enough for you to change things.
ReplyDeleteAnd I fear it will get worse; the Norwegian Anders Behring Brevick showed the way on the 22nd of July 2011 when he killed 77 and injured about 320 with his combined bombing and shooting. I fear we’ll see more such “spectaculars” in future in which the assailant goes for maximum effect. Car bombs made of fertilizer and diesel are quite easy to construct (Brevick had some 3tons of ammonium nitrate and 3 tons of calcium ammonium nitrate that he’d legitimately) and his bomb was only some 950 kilos of his stock.
Its only going to get worse. Regards, Charley Farns-Barns.
I hope you're wrong about the escalation, Charley. If we do nothing about automatic weapons capable of shooting round after round, we are likely to see more of the same.
DeleteVery definitely agree with The Padre here. Agree with you and Russ that in our childhood we knew the difference between make believe and real.
ReplyDeleteI was very interested in Paul (A.'s) link to the tracking of these mass killings since the Brady incident. Some of these mass killings, the Columbine killings for instance, were the result of bullying which was brought to the attention of the Columbine school authorities and never acted upon. The recent Wisconsin killings seem to be the work of a white supremacist. The Aurora, Colorado incident seems to be based on the killer's inability to distinguish fact from fiction. So, I guess what I am wondering here is, has anyone broken down all of this data into contributing factors? Social, political, and economic. By state, date and motives. What is the motivation of "the frustrated outcast sociopaths/psychopaths" (quoted from Leonardo above).
Bonnie, I have more questions than answers. We need better mental health services and less access to powerful automatic weapons. Beyond that...
DeleteYes starting with those two things would be very good indeed. Beyond that...
ReplyDeleteOther factors that I think contribute to this would be lack of parental supervision and the failure of people in positions of trust to act on information they have been given about anti-social behaviors. The parents of the students who were responsible for the Columbine massacre were definitely uppermiddle class and very well educated but too busy to provide guidance and intervention for their children.
There is a subtle brainwashing by the media--if you had this thing, or wore this thing, or thought this thing--you would be successful and happy, you would be in control.
Don't get me started on the media, Bonnie.
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