Wednesday, December 10, 2008

Testing For Deep-seated Tendencies

From the Church Times:

CANDIDATES for the priesthood in the Roman Catho­lic Church are to undergo psycho­logical screening that will identify “deep-seated homo­sexual tenden­cies”, the Vatican has announced,

Gay men thus identified will be deemed unsuitable as seminarians, even if they have no difficulty in re­maining celibate, says the document from the Congregation for Catholic Education, Guidelines for the Use of Psychology in the Admission and Formation of Candidates for the Priesthood.

Such screening, it says, would help avoid what the report calls “tragic situations” caused by psychological defects, an undoubted reference to the damaging and costly number of sexual-abuse cases exposed in recent years.


This is such a vicious load of crap, that I'm left outraged and nearly speechless, but not completely. Since the document is not yet fully translated into English, should we give the Vatican the benefit of doubt that the "tragic situations" do not refer to child abuse by gay priests, but rather to CHILD ABUSE BY PRIESTS WHO HAVE DEEP-SEATED TENDENCIES TO ABUSE CHILDREN?

Cardinal Zenon Grocholewski, who presented the report, is reported to have described homo­sexuality as “a deviation, an irregu­larity, a wound” even for celibate gay men.

More from Cardinal Grocholewski in The Catholic Herald:

Cardinal Grocholewski, prefect of the Congregation for Catholic Education, said "The candidate does not necessarily have to practice homosexuality. He can even be without sin. But if he has this deeply seated tendency, he cannot be admitted to priestly ministry precisely because of the nature of the priesthood, in which a spiritual paternity is carried out. Here we are not talking about whether he commits sins, but whether this deeply rooted tendency remains."

He added: "It's not simply a question of observing celibacy as such. In this case, it would be a heterosexual tendency, a normal tendency.

"In a certain sense, when we ask why Christ reserved the priesthood to men, we speak of this spiritual paternity, and maintain that homosexuality is a type of deviation, a type of irregularity, as explained in two documents of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.

"Therefore it is a type of wound in the exercise of the priesthood, in forming relations with others. And precisely for this reason we say that something isn't right in the psyche of such a man. We don't simply talk about the ability to abstain from these kinds of relations."


There is so much wrong with Cardinal Groch's statement, that I don't know where to begin. His words are cruel, insulting, and unpastoral in the extreme. What about his responsibility to exercise "spiritual paternity" for the gay men in his church?

Thus, a priest is not capable of "spiritual paternity" unless he is robustly heterosexual, a true manly man. Of course, the idea of Jesus as exercising "spiritual paternity" doesn't seem quite trinitarian to me. I don't know about you, but I've always thought of Jesus as more of a brother than a father.

In the light of recent history, will the candidates be tested for deep-seated tendencies to child abuse? Why the focus on homosexuality? In the US church, which is already suffering from a severe shortage of priests, and where the estimates of the percentage of gay priests range from 10% to 40%, the result will be a large drop in the numbers of candidates considered suitable for seminary and, I would think, a large drop in the numbers of men who present themselves as candidates.

It seems to me that "something isn't right in the psyche of such a man" as Cardinal Groch and the men in the Vatican who make these decisions. Of course, I could be wrong.

Now, I'll stop, because I seem to be babbling.

One more thing. What about shallow-seated homosexual tendencies?

H/T to Lapin.

32 comments:

  1. Why not just hold up a mirror and see if we have a reflection?

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  2. All they need now is a pool of 100% heterosexual candidates...who don't ever want to get married or have sex with women. That should help the priest shortage.

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  3. I think this ought begin by his Holiness the Grand Wizard of former Nazi dangerous stupidity taking THE TEST first, example and all, spiritual leadership and all...it is HIM that has a troubling look of ¨inner taintedness¨ and obessive emotional zealotry in his ¨being¨...IT´S this cushy old man who ought to stop swishing around in BROCADE and get to the fronts in SUDAN, ZIMBABWE, UGANDA and HELP the cause of PEACE by serving the marginalized, the sick, the starving and the troubled (instead of sniffing for trouble inside other peoples innermost, albeit mostly healthy, celibate thoughts!

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  4. I meant to write about the mirror, too, but my thoughts were not really collected after I read the drivel.

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  5. This is the spinning out of a corrupted theology, based on sexism and dualism, coupled with elevating a policy (celibacy) to a requirement. A forumla for disaster produced a disaster; this present "solution" will only make matters worse.

    No one who has any robust sexuality at all should inflict upon himself (it's all "hims" in this himbook) a bondage of celibacy. Celibacy is a supernatural calling, a gift, and those not called to it will act out in inappropriate ways -- breaking their vows and sometimes harming others.

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  6. The more candidates they turn away, the fewer priests they have. It just hastens the day when the whole enterprise comes crashing down. And then, as WB Yeats reminds us, "those that build them again are gay."

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  7. Ok, I'm not licensed as a psychologist yet (knock on wood) but I am in the dissertation writing stage of this damned doctorate and I'm doing it in the area of assessment and testing.

    So, take it for what it is worth but for the life of me I have no clue how they plan to test for this. Go back to the old scale 5 on the MMPI? Discredited and not psychometrically reliable or valid.

    What other psychological assessment test or inventory would supposedly show this? None. There are none.

    How on earth would one even begin to test for a "stable sense of masculinity"? Any psychologist who played along would be using invalid testing methods or tests. Which would put them up for ethics complaints to the APA, state associations and to state licensing boards. And no other profession in the US is licensed to interpret psychological testing and there are penalties and state boards like to impose those penalties to protect the profession of psychology.

    I am dying to hear how they plan to put this in place.

    And if I hear of any masters level therapists playing along I will call the state board and their professional association. (State boards can take away licensure and ethics censure from professional associations will get one thrown off of insurance provider panels). I have no problem making a call over this or filing a written complaint.

    Ditto for licensed psychologist who tries to use phony tests or assess something not within the recognized scope of practice.

    And if any other professionals that I personally know of (including RC clergy) start pretending to be psychologists (by giving and interpreting phony psychological tests) I will report that to the state, too.

    And I would encourage everyone else to do the same.

    Let's see how they plan to implement this one. Because I honestly believe that playing with phony tests could cost a professional their license to practice psychology.

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  8. But there are two infallible tests of sexuality. I learned them in high school.

    You ask the suspected person of impaired masculinity to look at his fingernails, and the sole of one of his shoes. The manly macho man will look at his fingernails by folding his fingers into his palm, while the person suffering from the deep wound of homosexuality will extend his fingers, palm facing outwards. When it comes to the shoes, the he-man will cross his leg in front of him to look at his shoe sole, while the nancy-boy will kick one foot up backwards, looking over his shoulder to catch a glimpse of the sole.

    It can't miss, I tell ya.

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  9. uh... Billy, both the nail and sole tests fail as diagnostic in my case. Is that a false negative?

    Dennis, you remind me of the righteous anger of Kris Kringle against Mr. Sawyer for pretending to practice psychotherapy. Yeah... get 'em.

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  10. No, Tobias, the tests are just as infallible as - well, as the Pope. It's you who must be wrong. You must just be confused about your sexuality.

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  11. John Bassett, do you see signs of a death wish?

    Now that the experts in theology and psychology have weighed in, along with the infallible tester, BillyD, I hardly know what to say, except, "Yo!"

    One thing, BillyD. I did the fingernails the girlie way, but when I looked at the sole of my shoe, I did it like a MAN. What does that say about me?

    Ramble away, Renz.

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  12. "This is such a vicious load of crap."

    Uh huh.

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  13. Grandmère, I'm afraid it might mean that you wear slacks...

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  14. Forget the psycho-babble. The basic question is: Are their wrists limp? If "yes" then they cannot elevate the chalice at Mass; if no, well they might be considered ...

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  15. BillyD, I also fail both your tests and I have no heterosexual deviancy:-)

    If a religiously inclined young male discovers he has homosexual tendencies which are forbidden by his beliefs, there is little wonder he may seek the escape of a celibate priesthood. When the escape proves illusive later in life, problems are created. I thank God I was not RC as a youth. Despite the problems my evangelical beliefs created, at least celibate priesthood was not a possibility. If the Catholic church thinks it can continue to function with only red hot heterosexual males able to maintain a celibate lifestyle becoming priests, it is doomed.

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  16. Exactly where in the gospels did Christ reserve the priesthood for men????? He must use a different Bible than I do.

    And what about priests who sin with women? Is that all right? It does happen. At one of my former parishes (when I was still Catholic), the associate pastor left the priesthood because he became involved with a woman,.

    You're right. It's a bunch of bull**it.

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  17. I'm telling ya, Brian - the test never fails! You must be going through a phase or something.

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  18. Billy, fess up. You stole that one off of Murphy Brown!

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  19. BillyD, I do wear slacks.

    If the Catholic church thinks it can continue to function with only red hot heterosexual males able to maintain a celibate lifestyle becoming priests, it is doomed.

    Brian, that's the quote of the day. Someone tell the Vatican.

    Ruth, paternalism dies hard.

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  20. The mechanics of shallow-seated versus deep-seated tendencies is not to be discussed in polite society, Mimi,

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  21. Serious question: what is the theological anthropological rationale behind the "deep-seated tendency"?

    I mean: "sin," I KNOW.

    "Without sin": I can understand (Praise Christ! . . . and maybe Mary, but there's disagreement about the latter *g*)

    But "deep-seated tendency"? If it's a result of "The Fall," shouldn't there be some actual SIN involved?

    And if there isn't, shouldn't we be hailing this condition, as a form of holiness?

    I don't get it . . . and strongly suspect that (in the infamous words of "The Downing Street Memo") the RCC is "fixing the facts to match the policy."

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  22. They've just eliminated their biggest recruitment factor.

    Renz, yes. That's the death wish that John Bassett and I talked about.

    Lapin, I see. I won't mention it again.

    ...the RCC is "fixing the facts to match the policy."

    JCF, exactly. And it's not the first time.

    I don't understand what they mean by "deep-seated tendency", nor do I see how they will test the candidates to weed out those so afflicted. Dennis, the almost psychologist, says they can't test to find the tendency. That makes sense to me.

    Of course, here we are talking about it when Lapin says we mustn't.

    What they are doing now is a new thing, else how could the estimates of closeted and not-so-closeted gay RCC priests be so high? Apparently, the powers weren't weeding them out before.

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  23. Her Majesty the Bishop of Rome needs to get off her cathedra and go stare in the mirror for, say, a decade, maintaining holy silence and ensuring that all curial offices to the same. Then they may speak, softly and with no guarantee of credibility yet.

    What utter bollocks!

    (I'm not MP, so I will use rude terms.)

    What a sick and twisted lot they are.

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  24. Mimi, I agree that "something isn't right in the psyche of such a man" as the author of this statement. While I am not licensed to diagnose anybody, I believe that the correct technical term to describe Cardinal G. is "pervert".

    As JCF would say, Lord have mercy!

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  25. Paul, "Her Majesty the Bishop of Rome" is very good. There should be a prize.

    Mary Clara, ya think?

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  26. There's almost no one coming forward with a vocation as it is. Is this some sort of prolonged suicide note?

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  27. Mimi
    is your blog part of polite society?

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  28. DP, that's what it looks like to me.

    Erika, I suppose that I can no longer make that claim.

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  29. Mimi
    If it would help to restore your credibility I could promise not to visit for a while...

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  30. I don't know Mimi. You were highly respectable when I first met you.

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  31. The Orthodox Church has a remedy for the problems that gay priests cause as clergy. It is called a "Matushka", which is a vocation.

    When a Priest starts having non-hetrosexual thoughts or even aduterous thoughts, the Matushka nags and swings her rolling pin to knock some sense into his head. Of course, if the Priest decides to focus his romantic desires upon the Matushka, nothing happens except that the Priest gets a larger family.

    The Catholic Church needs to consider adding "Matushka" to their list of vocations.

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