Will the recent child abuse scandal out of Germany, which moves closer to Pope Benedict XVI, affect the anticipated stampede of disaffected Anglicans and Episcopalians to the Roman Catholic ordinariates?
Will Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams now concern himself less with the response/reaction of the Vatican to decisions by churches in the Anglican Communion?
How will Rome's scandal affect the deliberations on the Anglican Covenant, by which certain members of the Anglican Communion seek to centralize authority in the Anglican Communion?
I would guess that the answers to the first two questions are: no and no. And the answer to three is: it won't. I'm being pessimistic this morning, even though there's lot of sun outside,
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mother Amelia. I don't think the Anglicans concerned place such a high priority on the child abuse scandal as they do on letting women and gays be bishops.
ReplyDeleteAh, you two! But then again, you may be right. And as MadPriest says, "But remember - you rarely meet a disappointed pessimist."
ReplyDeleteThe rank and file will not as easily play along, and I think that a few of the "eyes-on-Rome" folks may have second thoughts.
I second the above comments.
ReplyDeleteACNA is primarily driven by evangelicals. The Anglo Catholics from San Joaquin and Fort Worth find themselves marginalized within the schismatic movement.
I think it is more likely that they will try to deflect blame onto the "homosexual agenda," never mind that these scandals go back 40 and 50 years; before any gay boys had any agenda beyond Saturday night.
Interesting question though.
Some of the breakaways and wanna-be breakaways may find themselves with no place to go. Poor babies.
ReplyDeleteIs it possible that the scales will fall from certain pairs of eyes and allow them to see that there is no perfect church?
I guess not.
Does anybody really care that much about closer ties to Rome?
ReplyDeleteI'm of the opinion that those former TEC and Anglican schismatics - if they are still hell-bent on union with Rome - do *one thing* on their way out the door. Grab a copy of TEC's clergy sexual abuse policy(ies).
ReplyDeleteInsist that your super-duper more-Anglican-than-Thou Ordinariates adopt/adapt/whatever, the spirit if not the letter, of these policies. TEC's policies (however imperfect - and I've been critical of their application in some instances) are literally light years ahead of those coming out of Rome and her American franchises/dioceses. Not that I expect such folks to read your blog, but at least somebody has said it out loud.
Dooeman-Priest, yes! Rowan (Eyes-on-Rome) Williams, for one.
ReplyDeleteJohn, perhaps for the super-duper Anglicans, doctrinal correctness trumps child abuse.
I think that a few of the "eyes-on-Rome" folks may have second thoughts
ReplyDeleteI do think this is possible too, though there were always going to be those who wavered when push came to shove. There seems to have been a certain amount of flouncing and "if you don't play the game MY way I'm taking my bat and ball and leaving" about the whole thing anyway... which I guess is where the child abuse scandal might prove a decisive factor. But I still suspect for the diehards it won't make enough of a difference.
Rome has been and is turning more sour by the moment...I think whatever good will that was gained by Pope JP2 is quickly disappearing because of a cloak of arrogance...this is the age of FULL awareness and the religious ¨tricks¨ (literally) of the past won´t cover shoddy character when it is exposed from under brocaded robes (or not)...the only avenue to wellness is with stark honesty followed by humble openess/amends (self and institutional)...my opinion only.
ReplyDeleteI don't rejoice in any of this misfortune that the leaders in RCC have brought upon themselves and their church, but I believe that it's way past time that their misdeeds were brought into the light. It seems beyond question to me that the massive cover-up was orchestrated from the Vatican.
ReplyDeleteNo. After all they were already in favor of abusing women.
ReplyDeleteCardinal, {ooops} Archbishop Williams won't turn a page.
On 3, I am quite certain the would be centralizers have no sense of the obvious issues. After all, they want to centralize because they are holy and so have nothing in common with Rome.
FWIW
jimB
Jim, I believe that Rowan may do a bit of a turn away from being so desirous of Rome's approval. For the others, the scandal probably won't make a difference.
ReplyDeleteGood questions! but I fear the answers are mostly in the negative...
ReplyDeleteGöran, we shall see.
ReplyDeleteI don't believe there was EVER going to be a "stampede" to the Ordinariate. At the end of the day, they'd rather be a LOUD, disgruntled fish in a small pond (or else, independent altogether), rather than be tiny indistinguishable fish in a humongous Roman pond. [This latest RC scandal MIGHT be an excuse, but probably not. Better to hold out Rome as unreachable Ideal, as opposed to the sinful MESS it actually is---in contrast to the messy sinners that ALL of us are!]
ReplyDeleteI don't believe there was EVER going to be a "stampede" to the Ordinariate.
ReplyDeleteNor do I, JCF. My use of the word was ironic.
I would agree with the "pessimists," but for a reason that applies across the board, not just in the RCC:
ReplyDeleteChildren are amongst the "least of these," and, anytime you get a well-established hierarchy, the least of these don't interest them in the slightest.
The ordinariate group are clergy-led, and patriarchal, authoritarian clergy at that. Frankly, however subconciously, I think they will actually enjoy the idea of being in a structure in which their position is so elevated they would not be held responsible.
Scandals like this are not on Williams' radar. He's the ABoC, not a social worker! He's said as much himself, and his political ambitions have not dimmed.
As for the Covenant, those busily weaving that web don't care about anyone else in the Communion, why would Rome's problems. This "covenant" has never actually been about ecumenism or a united church or anything like that: the One Church idea is a dream, a fantasy and a lost cause. It will never happen. But, you can use this covenant to cut a big power deal for certain people in their own little branch of the Church.
One chance it might hurt all this - excluding the self-absorbed covenant group - is if Rome is really materially hurt and humiliated in a public and non-spinnable way. Having to pay until the bishops and up do without. Having to make an abject apology. Snubs by formerly fawning heads of state. Public and defiant - HIGH PROFILE - defections from within.
Without that, it'll just be swept away by a pontifical hand, just as those children were.
Without that, it'll just be swept away by a pontifical hand, just as those children were.
ReplyDeleteMark you're probably right.
I don't think there's any way to spin the predicament that the pope is in now, but many others very likely disagree.