As I've said before, I hate that the candidates think that they must do appearances at forums like the one arranged by Rick Warren of "Purpose Driven" this-that-and-the-other-thing book fame and pastor of the mega-, mega-, mega-church called Saddleback. Moral character, principles, good judgment, and a modicum of intelligence are important for a candidate, but I dislike intensely the focus on religious faith. That should not be part of the equation. Why didn't the candidates follow Nancy Reagan's advice and "just say no"? Because they couldn't; that's why. In today's climate, it's not possible for a politician to say "no" to that sort of event here in the US.
Let me say up front that I did not watch the show. I meant to, but I forgot. That's probably for the best. Rmj at Adventus has an excellent post about the forum, ($500 to $2000 a ticket) or whatever it was, at Rick Warren's church. I dismissed any thought of writing about this event after reading his post. It's not short, (Rmj's posts hardly ever are) and he puts you to work with links and all, so be prepared, but you won't be sorry if you take the trouble. I started off laughing at the ridiculousness of the entire event and at some of the quotes from the forum. Then, I ended up wanting to cry. What in the hell kind of craziness are we engaged in this political season?
Mimi: It eappears there were a couple of problems with the forum:
ReplyDeleteFirst, McCain was NOT secluded while Obama was being questioned. While he states he did NOt hear the questions, Rick Warren asked Obama a three-part question on education. When he got to that question with McCain, McCain interupted his initial part of the question & raapidly answered all three--although they were NOT asked of him. Amazing!
Also, McCain told a fascinating war story about how a guard drew a cross in the sand, in front of McCain on Christmas day. Almost brought tears to yur eyes. However, it is very much like a story written by Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn. Go figure! While, in his defense, McCain has been telling this story for nine years now, it did NOT appear in his indredably detailed account of his captivity of his imprisonment which appeared in US News & World Report in 1973. And, he did not tell it prior to 1999. Of course, he may not have read Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn until then.
Doug, Rmj quotes from the NYT:
ReplyDeleteSenator John McCain was not in a “cone of silence” on Saturday night while his rival, Senator Barack Obama, was being interviewed at the Saddleback Church in California.
If McCain actually read Solzhenitsyn, I'd be surprised, but he may have picked up the quote somewhere and run with it. He has no credibility left, as far as I'm concerned, none. Unfortunately, it's apparent that many in the country still put their trust in him. Thanks for that little tidbit. I actually remember that quote from Solzhenitsyn.
Note also that Obama and McCain were fed different questions by Warren, with Obama prompted to answer from his personal religious viewpoint and McCain given openings to push his political talking points.
ReplyDeleteBut you can dry your tears while listening to The Mighty Sparrow.
Re: Solzhenitsyn: apparently McCain was quite a fan, and used "Gulag" as a talking point more than once, indicating he was quite familiar with its contents.
ReplyDeleteWhat doug points out is largely confirmed: McCain was/is a huge fan of "Gulag Archipelago" (where the "cross in the sand" story comes from) and this story didn't become a part of McCain's "experience" until recently.
It may be McCain is convinced it happened to him; but it's very questionable, especially since the way he tells it so closely models the story in the Russian novel. It's a small thing, except it reminds me of Reagan's memories of Pearl Harbor, which he recounted as if they were history.
They were, of course, from a movie.
Paul, Obama was trapped. He had no choice but to play, although he and his advisers very likely knew that the dice were loaded.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the link to the song. It's much appreciated by me, although there are those, like Cokie Roberts, who may judge it to be too "foreign".
Doug, I retract my words about McCain not having read Solzhenitsyn. The evidence is that he did and that he "borrowed" a story and made it his own.
ReplyDeleteRmj, when I was in high school and college, the penalty for taking another's words and making them your own was academic death. However, it seems that a new day has dawned, and it's not such a bad thing after all.
That was an interesting post.
ReplyDeleteI did not watch the thing either.
A blogger that I linked to had a great post about it - IMO - she is not at all religious but she sure gets what might be required of someone actually living their faith rather than spouting about it.
The conventional wisdom, according to the newspeople, is that McCain "won" the forum. He "bonded" with the audience who paid $500-$2000 a ticket to watch. Does that mean they'd like to have a beer, er, Jack Daniels with McCain? OH NO! Not again.
ReplyDeleteI read Adventus' post, and I'm so glad I missed that clam bake.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if anyone over there in the Nothing-$uceed$-like-$ucce$$ school of Christianity ever noticed that Jesus was a rotten business model.
A man who leaves the family business to wander around homeless and dependent on the charity of others, proclaiming the coming of the Kingdom of Heaven, getting arrested, deserted by almost all of his followers, and then getting executed like a common criminal is most people's idea of a failure. I'm sure he'd NEVER merit a mention from Mark Warren.
Just more confirmation of my cranky inner cynic's idea that while we Americans bang on and on about God, Jesus, Family, Personal Responsibility, Confronting Evil, etc, etc, etc with long earnest pious faces, in fact we really don't believe in anything beyond what's written in a bank statement.
My inner cynic also wonders if so much of what we promote as "values" are really just survival skills.
I should also point out that the only people in the world who are fooled by these election year parades of public piety are ourselves.
ReplyDeleteWho was it who observed that faith and piety are not synonymous?
On the whole "Cone of Silence" thing, an examination of the transcript shows that McCain knew about an upcoming question about Supreme Court justices before it was asked of him.
ReplyDeleteOh Paul! Thank you for that. This is the bizarro campaign in the Bizarro Land that the US has become. I want it to go away!
ReplyDelete